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Topic: «Desktop divider questions , Using AWM 7.0 beta 1 » on forum: Beta Testing   Views: 77376
 
Pim Joosten
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Posted: 19.01.2012 01:19:03
 
 
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If this is implemented it has to be optional, because it would make snapping to the vertical borders very complicated/impossible. For the same reasons maybe also the dropping to the upper horizontal border should be optional.
I think both options (dropping to the horizontal / vertical borders) are very useful, but depending on how the user uses the desktop divider, he should be able to (de-)activate them.
If both options could be made optional, that would be good. I personally have no problems finding the difference between dropping and snapping to the horizontal border. For snapping I have to actually touch the border of the desktop, whereas for dropping it is the small area next to the border. There is also a color difference. Red is for dropping and blue for snapping (I have changed the standard snapping color).

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Another thing: It is almost impossible to get a clear 3x3-Grid (so 9 tiles of equal size). There should be an option to uniformly distribute all collumns / rows or something like that.
I think this is a good suggestion.

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My idea is the following: In the "Put into..."-Window i can select exactly one Tile to put (move and maximize) a window in. So you could add the following: If i press a certain modifier key (for example ctrl), i have to select the upper-left tile, and the bottom-right tile of the area the window should be maximized to.
Yes, I get what you mean and I like it. It would be especially handy on big monitors.
 
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Bertram Vogel
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Posted: 19.01.2012 08:06:56
 
 
Quote
If both options could be made optional, that would be good. I personally have no problems finding the difference between dropping and snapping to the horizontal border. For snapping I have to actually touch the border of the desktop, whereas for dropping it is the small area next to the border. There is also a color difference. Red is for dropping and blue for snapping (I have changed the standard snapping color).

I think you are talking about the "AeroSnap"-Feature, but i mean the "Classic Window Snapping" (useful if you don't want to maximize windows to tiles, but want to arrange windows and use the tile-borders as "guidelines").
But after moving and snapping windows around for a while if have to admit, that also the classic snapping to horizontal tile borders works very nice. It is only a bit difficult if you clicked the window title bar on the very top, because if you now move the window to a horizontal tile border from below you are almost always in the red zone and have to move back the mouse pointer a little bit to only snap the window.
But snapping to vertical borders should be never a problem, because the user almost ever clicks the window title bar in the middle (if he want so move around the window).
So after reconsidering: No need for the options in my opinion ;)

-------

Another thing: AWM allows snapping windows to the desktop/monitor borders and to other windows also when RESIZING the window. So (optional) the desktop divider tile borders should also be shown when resizing a window (and not only when moving).
 
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Pim Joosten
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Posted: 19.01.2012 12:24:04
 
 
Quote
I think you are talking about the "AeroSnap"-Feature, but i mean the "Classic Window Snapping"
Yes, I was. That is the snapping function I use most frequently. When writing my reply I did not think of Classic window snapping, even though I use it on a less frequent basis.

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But after moving and snapping windows around for a while if have to admit, that also the classic snapping to horizontal tile borders works very nice. It is only a bit difficult if you clicked the window title bar on the very top, because if you now move the window to a horizontal tile border from below you are almost always in the red zone and have to move back the mouse pointer a little bit to only snap the window.
Now that I know you were talking about Classic window snapping, I've tested this too. It does turn out to play nicely. One just has to get a little feeling for it, but I got it in less than 30 seconds.

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But snapping to vertical borders should be never a problem, because the user almost ever clicks the window title bar in the middle
Agreed.

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Another thing: AWM allows snapping windows to the desktop/monitor borders and to other windows also when RESIZING the window. So (optional) the desktop divider tile borders should also be shown when resizing a window (and not only when moving).
Another good one  :idea:   Apparently you are experimenting with the desktop divider more than I am, as I usually have it switched off, because of the "maximize issue". I hope that gets solved soon. I think this thread has given Vasiliy and Alex so much input, that they need some time to absorb it, and that's why we have not heard from them yet  ;) (No pun intended :!: , I know  you are working hard and you always maintain good communication, so take your time  :) )
 
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Pim Joosten
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Posted: 23.01.2012 14:46:55
 
 
Well, this is a bummer to be honest. According to this information the maximize button is supposed to maximize to a desktop tile and not the monitor. I guess that I could switch to using "desktop tiles active while modifier key pressed", but I still think Bertrams idea is much, much better: a separate maximize to divider tile button. Apart from my argument made above that that would be consistent to normal Windows behavior, I also think it is strange that the maximize button always stays a maximize button and never becomes a restore button.

Also, on my laptop (using Vista Ultimate 32-bit) I just reverted back to AWM 6.7 because since 2 days ago I continuously get AWM error messages right after logging on in Windows and AWM can not start. I have sent the automatically generated error reports to Actual Tools with an explanation. Right now it is very simple: if I go back to version 6.7 by installing on top of 7.0 beta 1, all errors disappear. If I then install 7.0 beta 1 on top of 6.7 the issues immediately come back. The strange thing is that the error only started to appear 6 days after first installation of AWM 7.0 beta 1. The only other thing that I did on that day was an upgrade of Roboform from version 7.6.8 to 7.7.0. But the AWM issue remains if I uninstall Roboform, so it must be associated with the beta.

By now, could we get a response to this thread Vasiliy or Alex? It does seem that the regular release will be published soon, because you have posted the new item on the desktop divider in your news list, but we have not heard from Actual Tools yet in this extensive desktop divider thread.

EDIT:
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I also think it is strange that the maximize button always stays a maximize button and never becomes a restore button
It does become a restore button only when the window is maximized to the monitor. But I think this is inconsistent too: clicking the button makes it maximize and restore to the desktop tile, but the sign of the button only changes when it is maximized to the monitor. IMHO another reason to have a separate button for maximizing to a desktop tile.
 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 07:57:25
 
 
Pim, Bertram, Gerard,

Many thanks for such a fruitful discussion! Sorry for not getting back to you for a long time - the recently released betas generate a lot of feedback to handle (if not to mention the regular everyday duties :)).

I have read the entire thread carefully and would like to admit that you've done a pretty good job! It's a real pleasure for us to have such a loyal and devoted beta testers. :)

Most of reports, notices and suggestions are true, to say the least. I will try to summarize them below in separate messages and make my comments to each item.
 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 10:08:54
 
 
First of all - a bit of info on Desktop Divider's purpose.

First, it's been designed as a tool for a quick allocation of windows side-by-side without overlapping to use the available screen estate in most efficient manner. That's why you can have as many layouts as you need and switch between them quickly.

Second, we had been receiving many requests to provide a facility that would allow to divide the large single desktop into smaller areas (we call them tiles), which would work like virtual monitors - with the ability to maximize a window onto such monitor (of course, using the standard Maximize button and other ways of maximization), to quickly move windows between such monitors, etc. That's why we have changed by default the usual behavior of the Maximize button. However, implementing true virtual monitors (with taskbars, full-screen apps and other stuff) require too much efforts so the Desktop Divider is just a first approximation, which may be (or may be not) developed further in this direction.

Hope this clarifies a bit our goals and made design decisions (I have to admit that not all of them were good :) ).
 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 10:23:14
 
 
1. Maximize button by default stretches a window over the Divider tile, not the Desktop.

This was possibly the most disputable design decision we made. After reviewing your discussion, I'm tending to accept Bertram's suggestion to make this behavior optional. Its current implementation looks confusing as the button doesn't change its picture (because the window, of course, is not really maximized - we just intercept the system command and handle it in our own way). Probably, we could implement our own maximization but there might arise possible conflicts with various non-standard windows.

Also, this decision was made at the beginning, when we didn't have a special title button for Desktop Divider functions. Now, we can leave the Maximize button as it is and make the new button responsible for tile operations.
 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 10:29:32
 
 
2. Buttons in the Tile Layout Editor.

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Pim: Then I think that when editing the desktop divider the I and the regular I should be changed to a more clear symbol like >I< for making a horizontal division and the same but then rotated 90 degrees for a vertical division

After reading this feedback, the buttons have been changed in the following way (hope it's acceptable :) ):

 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 10:36:33
 
 
3. Tile numbers.

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Pim: How is the numbering of desktop tiles supposed to be in a multi-monitor setup?

Tile numbers must begin from 1 on each monitor. Their current purpose is to define the order for moving a window from one tile to another via left click on the Put into Divider Tile title button. Right click on this button invokes the Tile Selector, which displays all tiles on all monitors so that you can easily place the window where you want.

Note: Left clicking on the title button when the window is in the last tile on a certain monitor will place the window into the first tile on the same monitor by design. That's whay tiles are numbered on each monitor independently.
 
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Alex Fadeyev
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Posted: 24.01.2012 10:44:00
 
 
4. Put into Divider Tile button..

The following bugs have been confirmed and now is being fixed:
  • button lost its picture after the first click

  • button does not appear on some newly opened windows, even if it's enabled in the configuration

  • button does not react on switching the Desktop Divider on/off (does not disappear if the Divider was on and does not appear if it was off; both cases consider that button itself is enabled)
 
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